OTS 159: Turning Knowledge Into Action as a School-Based OTP
- Jayson Davies
- Sep 30, 2024
- 37 min read
Updated: Dec 18, 2024
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Welcome to the show notes for Episode 159 of the OT Schoolhouse Podcast.
Have you ever wondered how the knowledge you gain from a podcast can be effectively applied in real-world practice?
In this episode, Taylor Poirier, shares her insightful journey of how she has implemented what she’s learned from about 150 OT Schoolhouse podcast episodes into her everyday practice.
Tune in to discover the actionable steps she took, the resources she utilized, and the challenges she navigated to become a dynamic force in school-based occupational therapy.
Listen now to learn the following objectives:
Learners will identify strategies for applying knowledge gained from podcast episodes.
Learners will identify tips to guide new school-based occupational therapy practitioners.
Learners will recognize ways to stay organized to be able to best implement podcast insights.
Guests Bios
Taylor graduated from University of St. Augustine, Miami Campus in December 2022. She began working as a pediatric OT within the schools and home health setting with Alyssa Campbell Therapies in the Tampa, FL area.
She loves learning and creating new ways of therapy for the most client-centered approach. She has now created resources based on the information provided in this podcast and can truly see a difference in the progress her kids make. She loves making other therapists feel confident and excited about the world of OT!
Quotes
“Teachers are truly our biggest fans when it comes to what we're able to do for their students. Because their whole goal is to get that student to learn and participate and be functional within their space.”
-Taylor Poirier OTD, OTR/L
“We gotta give our teachers a little bit more grace. We gotta give a little bit more grace maybe during that IEP meeting too, just to make sure we're all on the same page and we're all understanding everyone's perspective.”
- Taylor Poirier OTD, OTR/L
“Because we all know co regulation, if the teachers are dysregulated, so is the child.”
- Taylor Poirier OTD, OTR/L
“You can always advocate for yourself, and making the connections is a really a big part of that as well.”
-Taylor Poirier OTD, OTR/L
“When it comes to collaboration, you have to meet the other person on their level. If they are another provider, what do they know about OT? Have they ever collaborated with occupational therapists before? Do you guys have the same goals based off what your child in your case looks like...”
Taylor Poirier OTD, OTR/L
“We're going to make mistakes. You can't not make mistakes. You are human.”
-Jayson Davies, M.A, OTR/L
“Don't continue doing something that has always been done at the school for the sole purpose that that's the way they did it.“
-Jayson Davies, M.A, OTR/L
Resources
Episode Transcript
Expand to view the full episode transcript.
Jayson Davies
Hey there, have you ever listened to an episode of the otschoolhouse com podcast, gotten some great documentation treatment, maybe even some evaluation ideas, but then never actually took action on those ideas? Well, today, we are addressing that very unfortunate series of events head on with Dr Taylor Poirier, when Taylor became an occupational therapist. A little over 18 months ago, she had some big ideas. You know, she was ready to take on the school based ot world by storm, but with so much knowledge from various outlets the podcast included, she had to put a system in place to actually take action on everything she was learning. That is why, when Taylor reached out about recording an episode related to implementing what you actually learn on the podcast, I was extremely quick to say, Yes, please. So that's what you're going to hear today. In this episode, you're going to hear how Taylor selects episodes, takes notes, creates action plans and moves forward with those plans to support both herself and the students she supports, from incorporating primitive reflex strategies to finding innovative ways to engage with colleagues and students. She has mastered the art of learning on the go and applying the knowledge practically. If you enjoy the otschoolhouse podcast, but find yourself struggling to actually implement what you learn from every episode, this is the episode for you stick around as we explore how to transform knowledge into action and enhance your impact as a school based occupational therapy practitioner. Without further ado, let's dive into this enriching conversation with Dr Taylor Poirier.
Amazing Narrator
Hello and welcome to the otschoolhouse com, your source for school based occupational therapy tips, interviews and professional development. Now to get the conversation started, here is your host, Jayson Davies class is officially in session.
Jayson Davies
Taylor, welcome to the otschoolhouse podcast. How you doing today?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Doing great. How are you doing?
Jayson Davies
Fantastic. You know, this is fun. We are having a little bit of tech issues, but we are making it work. I love it. I'm like, looking at your face, but hearing you from your other Zoom account. And, yeah, this is fun. Thanks for being here, and thank you for also attending the back to school conference. I hope that was a lot of fun for you.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah, back to school conference was amazing. And thank you so much for having me on the podcast today. I'm really excited to get into our conversation.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, so you actually reached out to me, which happens sometimes with podcast guests, and you're like, I'm a school based ot practitioner, and I have listened to a lot of episodes, but it's sometimes hard to actually implement some of what you know you learn there's 150 some odd episodes. Like, how do I know which one's the right one to listen to? And even if I do listen to all of them, like, how do I know where to begin with starting to implement them and and I think a lot of people kind of probably are in a similar boat, right? Like, you take in all this information, but how do you actually put it to good use? So you're going to help us with that a little bit today, I think, right, yep, absolutely awesome. Awesome. Well, let's go ahead and get started, and I just want to give you an opportunity to kind of share a little bit about yourself and where you are in your ot career right now.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
So I am about a year and a half into my ot career. I'm based in the Tampa Bay area. I currently work with a company called Alyssa Campbell therapies. So we service the the Tampa Bay area. And what's unique about our company is that it is school based as well as home health based. So we really get the unique opportunity to be in all of the most natural environments of our students and our children that we service. So I can be in the school one day, it could be at their house the next, and then we could be at the park. At the park, the grocery store, the library the next day. So I, I've always loved pediatrics. I've always felt most comfortable in pediatrics, and so I've just, I've entered the school based setting, and now I really don't see myself ever leaving. Awesome, awesome. I love that,
Jayson Davies
because you get the kind of the both sides of it. And this isn't a question that I was planning to ask you today, but since you kind of are experienced in both the school realm as well as the more the community outside of the school realm, what do you see as some of the differences, if any, or do you see it as being more similar?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
So I definitely think, speaking, you know, for myself, I see it's very similar. I think sometimes, as school based therapists, we kind of put ourselves in a box that we don't have to be in, and the things that you may work on at someone's house or at a clinic setting, you can do that in the schools with spaces that you're given. We're very creative and we're very flexible people in this field. So it's a lot of the same needs, I think, just in a different place, all right? And
Jayson Davies
if your boss, Alyssa, listening, I'm going to ask her to cover her ears right now and ask you, Taylor, if you had to choose one, would you choose clinic, slash outpatient, slash community or school based?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Oh yeah, that is such a tough question. My I started off in OT like, pre grad school in an outpatient clinic, and I loved it, but I think my heart is with with school based so I would have to choose the schools, all right.
Jayson Davies
Awesome. Love it. You're on the right podcast. Then cool. We can continue this. We don't need to end the conversation right now. No, just kidding, Alyssa, you can uncover your ears right now. So, yeah. So you know, you've been in this field for about an A year and a half, you said, and it sounds like you found out about the otschoolhouse pretty quickly, but what were some of the challenges that you started to face as you were transitioning from being a student to helping students?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah, so I really didn't know anything, to be honest about school based. OT, it wasn't something that my university covered, you know, in depth. So I was really just looking for a setting I could be kind of an out of the box type of therapist. And so when I found this company, and I found these schools that I'm working with, I immediately was like, Oh my gosh, there is 101 things that I need to look at. The screenings are different. The documentation is different, the language and verbiage is different. And so I was like, I have got to find some sort of mentorship. So that was one area that I, you know, was really difficult at first. You know, navigating, we work primarily in the private schools, so navigating what their policies, procedures and protocols all look like, because they don't always, you know what we get taught in school. It's not always they abide by the same type so more so like five oh, fours, and then, as well as I'm a therapist who works out of her car, so trying to stay organized, how to travel with 101 treatment ideas for seven different kids at one school was definitely a very big challenge at first.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, yeah. And I know, you know, we've already mentioned you, you did find the otschoolhouse, and I know that's been helpful. But beyond the otschoolhouse com, what were some of the, some of the ways that you sought out, some of this mentorship, some of this help, what just kind of you can list them all off, what, where did you go for help?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
So I, you know, from school, we learned about, like, tools to grow, or OT toolkit, things of that nature, which are all websites with, you know, a plethora of information that are fabulous. So I really looked to those before I found out about the podcast, as well as just different content creators on Instagram, whether those were OTRS or codas, there are so many wonderful accounts I'll some of my favorites are, like, ot enlightenment, and there's sensory, which is not our field, but sensory, SLP, like, oh yeah, full information about that we can apply just to our field too. So those were kind of the big two that I would pull from.
Jayson Davies
Did you use any of like the Facebook groups or anything?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
I personally don't really use Facebook, but I have, I have colleagues that do, and they love it, and they love being part of those groups, and they get a lot out of it.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, there's a lot. I mean, there is just an uncountable number of people in them. Okay, there you can count them. It's like 40,000 but, yeah, those are just really, really big groups, and there's a lot of knowledge in there. There's also a lot of them have a lot of shared resources in there, which can also be helpful. They're just kind of hard to find sometimes, but definitely helpful. So very cool. So then, when did you stumble upon the otschoolhouse about?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
So I, as I kind of alluded to earlier, I travel out of my car. So I'll go to one school half the day, maybe another school, another and then I'm going to children's houses in the community. So all of my resources I had to have in my car. All the time spent commutes in the car. So I'm like, I gotta fill time. I can't just listen to music or sit in silence the whole time. So my first thought was like, let's see what kind of podcasts are out there. Let's see what ot resources for podcasts are available. And when I saw that there was a school based specific I was like, this is this is going to be fabulous. I can listen to this on my ride whether anything comes out of it a nugget or two, perfect. So then the more that I started listening. I'm like, oh my goodness, this is so much more than just a quick 30 minute throw on with my commutes or in between kids. This is continuing education. This is collaboration, and this is this is mentorship that's indirect. So once I found it, I have not stopped listening. I think I've listened to almost about every episode, about 150 or so, if you say it's definitely here to stay.
Jayson Davies
Wow. And now you're on the podcast. So full circle, right, right? Awesome, awesome. So, I mean, did you start at the beginning? Did you just start with, like, episode one? Or did was there a particular episode that kind of drew you in? And maybe, or maybe you don't remember that specific episode.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah. So I I started, I scrolled through all of them, and was looking more so like, what's something I haven't thought of lately? Or what is something that you know? Oh my gosh, I'm seeing a lot of this in my case. So let me list tune in. And at that time, I was probably like, my gosh, maybe a month. Or less into my, you know, my time as a practicing OT. And there was an episode titled Introduction to primitive reflexes, and something in my brain unlocked, and was like, Oh my gosh, I completely forgot that this is something that we handle and what we do, because I'm not sure if any of your listeners also went to grad school in the prime of covid. So everything was online. I remember my primitive reflex course was on a stuffed sloth that I had bought in trying to elicit the Palmer reflex and the Babinski and the Morro, everything on, you know, a stuffed animal. So I was listening to this podcast, and as I was listening, I was like, this is the this is the component missing in my caseload. There was this part that I couldn't identify with, you know, our common tools and assessments, and that's what really drew me in, because now that's completely changed my practice in the sense that I now forever include a primitive reflex screening, and now I'm actually going above and beyond and doing the certified primitive reflex specialist course, because I found it was to be just so crucial in my school based practice.
Jayson Davies
Wow, wow. So, because we want to get into you know how, how other ot practitioners can can learn from different episodes, but that first time that you listened, I mean, were you able to walk away from that episode and start making changes to your practice right away.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yes, absolutely. So it may seem you know at first glance like, oh my gosh, that's that's a little bit much. Maybe. How did you do that? But there were so many key reminders about just our education that we get as OTS that was enough to at least attempt a screening on a child or two the next day. You don't have to be perfect. You don't have you can trial an error. And that's definitely what I did, trying to put the kids in certain positions and try to identify the illicit reflexes and things. But it was enough to just get started and to kickstart that area of knowledge.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, and like you said, now you're working on the getting certified in it, and I think that's an important concept to remember with every single episode that we have here at the otschoolhouse com. Like we have a one hour interview with someone or a 45 minute interview with someone, and there's no way that it can be everything. And I think a lot of people want me to do more solo episodes, and I want to do more solo episodes. I really do, but especially in a healthcare field, especially in OT like none of us are an are an expert in everything, and so that's why we bring on these people. But even in that one hour interview, it's impossible to get through all of their knowledge to make everyone an expert that listened to this episode, and I think that that's really cool, that you were able to get enough to kind of get you started, and now you took that and you're like, Okay, I want more, and so you were able to find a way to go get more. So very cool.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah. Thank you. And I think too, it's the podcast does such a great job of kind of opening your horizon of what the subjects are that you're listening into, and I think they're all that we have touched on in our education at some point, whether you know initial graduate level or degree and continuing education, but it just, it kind of helps remind us of what we're capable of. So I think it's, it's definitely a great place to start for people.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, so you mentioned listening in your car, and I'm sure you still listen to some episodes in your car and whatnot. But do you also, I guess my question is, like listening in your car, is that enough? Or do you feel like or maybe sometimes you do? Do you sit down at a table and listen with a notepad? Or how do you actually remember what you're listening to while driving between school and a and b?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah. So I think it really depends. There's some podcasts that I kind of throw on as a refresher, almost, or kind of a revamp of some some knowledge before going seeing a kid, if it, you know, pertains particularly to them. But if I park I will quickly pull out my notes and do a little voice, text of tidbits, or an intervention idea that it gave me, or things that I can go back later and kind of work up whether that's creating a resource, adding it to a note, adding it to a report, things like that. And then there have been some other episodes that are very in depth, and they have so much information that you truly have to sit down and listen. And some of those kind of are like, there's an episode on autism strategies, an episode on handwriting research, there's an episode on trauma informed care, and so many others where it's really beneficial to sit down and just jot your notes. That way you have something very concrete. But I think there's a way to do it both, if you have a more photographic memory. I am not that person, but you can totally do it in your card by voice texting or doing it with pen and paper.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, and kind of add on to that, we're actually trying to help now, especially with the use of AI, we've had people ask us for transcripts of the episodes, and for a long time, that was just going to be like, honestly. Okay, it was too hard for us. It was costly. It required, like, you know, someone to sit down listen to the episode. And I had to kind of be someone who knew how to spell proprioception and vestibular and all those hard words that we used absolutely but now, but now we've got AI and so we are going back, and we're actually adding transcripts all the episodes. I know not everyone listens on Apple podcast, but Apple podcast is actually now transcribing every single podcast on Apple podcast, so we're trying to make it easier for everyone to kind of have that information in different ways. Because, like you said, not everyone learns the same way, and it's hard to sometimes listen to an hour long episode and remember what you actually listened to? So, yeah, good strategies. Okay, you mentioned a few episodes already, the primary one being the primitive reflexes of the episode. That kind of got you into it. But what have been some of the otschoolhouse com podcast episodes, or the topics even, because we've had some episodes, or some multiple episodes on a single topic that have had the biggest impact on your work in the schools?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yes, so there have been, I believe, two to three, maybe even more, on goal, writing and documentation. I'm not sure if you know it's just me or there's other people out there listening, where documentation is just a beast in itself. You know, we spend all day working so hard with our clients, and our cognitive load is already so full. So the moment we go to sit down and get those onto paper, it's, for me, it's really, really tough to articulate exactly what I'm thinking. And so I've actually, after listening to those, I created a goal Bank, which, there's an episode, I believe, solely on creating a goal bank and what that looks like. So now I have this ongoing document of just goals that are measurable, that I've seen progress in tracking, that are developmentally appropriate, age appropriate, and can be individualized for each child. And so that's been really helpful. There's been episodes on talking about our roots and mental health. I completed my doctoral Capstone within the mental health realm. So everything that I do naturally within my sessions is very mental health based. So to hear, and like you have other people talking about how they incorporate mental health, and are we mental health? You know, practitioners and providers, it's very reassuring that knowing you know what I'm doing is is appropriate with our children, and it's a need. So that's been really, really helpful, too. And you know one more for you to fostering autonomy and child led therapy, that is a specific name of one of the episodes, and when I tell you that opened Pandora's box of neurodivergent affirming care, it's really changed the way that I go into sessions and the way that I view my kids. You know, I think sometimes we we kind of have a checklist in play when we go into our sessions, or when we go into a whether it's an IEP meeting or we go in to have a parent meeting or a teacher meeting. And you know, we have these things that we want the child to do because maybe it's more rooted in a neurotypical world. And so this has really led me to follow the child's lead and think with the child's perspective of what they're doing, being led by the child, whether that's play or toys, and even a coloring activity is it's has enriched my my sessions, and I think the progress and also the buy in of the child. So I would say those, those three main topics, have been absolutely incredible for my practice.
Jayson Davies
Wow, it's into, I don't know, from from the host perspective, from my perspective, it's like so weird to actually hear these things from you, because these are episodes that I put together and, you know, I put them out into the world, and then I never actually hear from a lot of people like how it's impacting them. And so just to hear, you know, three different ways that you've taken a handful of our episodes and put them into practice. It's just quite amazing. So thank you. Let's talk about others. Let's talk about the OT practitioners who are listening today. And like I mentioned earlier, you're you're probably not the only one who has listened to episodes and maybe been a little bit overwhelmed or or didn't quite catch everything. And so do you have some strategies for those listening today that maybe they can put into practice as they listen to help them as they move forward.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah, absolutely. So when you because you can listen to a podcast and be like, Oh, I listened. It was fabulous, but you don't gain anything from it, and you feel like you can apply it, it's, it's difficult to, you know, kind of carry on. So I think, first off, find an episode that you are really passionate about, and you already have some baseline knowledge, because maybe it'll, it'll show you a different perspective. So while you're listening, you can voice, text the notes, just one or two little tidbits, and start small. And then go into your next child and and try to apply that. I think something key is the fear of trial and error, something that I had to learn, and I think all of us learn, you know, throughout our days, is we can't be afraid of the afraid of the trial and error, because just because something doesn't work for one child doesn't mean that it doesn't work across the board. So I think having that in your mind when you're listening is a great kind of tidbit to move forward. I think look for available resources already based off of the episode that you're listening to. A lot of the times, the show notes have wonderful information. Use those show notes. I know I have, and I've reached out to other you know, practitioners that have been on the podcast and attempted to connect with them, and that's even something else that you can do to apply your practice. If you have a question about something that you heard or you'd say you really would like to collaborate with them in some sort of way or pick their brain. OT, is such a small field. I feel like we hear that a lot. There's somebody that knows somebody who also knows the same person. We're very connected, and so don't be afraid to connect with the people that you're listening to as well, because I think that'll also help your understanding of what you're listening to, and also help grow your practice too. Because then that's kind of that's a building a community that's maybe virtual, but still very impactful.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, absolutely. I, I constantly am, like telling people, like they'll reach out to me and ask me about something on the podcast. I'm like to be honest, the person on the podcast said you could reach out to them. I highly recommend that you reach out to them, because, like you said, the OT world is small. Like, none of us got into ot to be Mr. Mrs. Bigwig, like, I'm too good for everyone, every single person that that we have on as a guest is always open and always sometimes I'll like, I'll send an introductory email, like, between the two people, the listener and the person on the podcast. And they're always so appreciative that, oh, thank you for connecting me with this person. And then the next thing I know, they're doing Doctor work together, something like that. It's just, it's really cool to see where things are going between people who listen and the people that are actually on the podcast. So, yeah, any other strategies for people that are listening and kind of just trying to implement,
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
yeah, I think staying organized while you're listening to the podcast. I know our brains run a million miles a minute, and there's always so many thoughts, and, you know, to do lists popping up in our head, but being able to, you know, if this is your time, to really invest in your work and invest in your career and your kids, take the time to find an organization system with it, whether that's, you know, podcast episodes, so and so on your notes, or you have a little journal that you keep in your car. If you're listening at home and you have that little space, organization will be key, and then you can keep track of it, and then you have that information forever. And it's not like it went in your one ear and then out the other, it's with you forever.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, do you ever find yourself listening to, like, the same episode over and over and over?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
there's one or two that is just so good. And I'm like, I'm gonna write that down, and then I go see my next kid, and I'm like, Oh, what am I gonna listen to? Oh, my gosh, this would be a good one. I have to admit, not perfect. Every time I listen, I have those same days too. But sometimes info is just so good, you gotta hear it twice.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, I mean, there's definitely some. So I can't stand hearing my own voice. I will be the first to tell you that, and so I don't go back and re listen to episode of the OT school house, but I have my own personal podcast that I'm very interested in. And with otschoolhouse com, a lot of the way that I learned how to start the otschoolhouse with business was through episodes. And there were definitely some episodes that I would like favorite, and I would go back and listen to them, not just not because I forgot what was in it or anything, but for the sole purpose of maybe either A, when I listened to it, I wasn't ready at the time, and so I knew when I would be ready for it, and when I was ready for it, I'd go back and listen to it, or b Maybe it just, I felt good when I listened to it, and so I kind of just put that into my mind, hey, this one episode, it's just like, it's got some positive vibes. And so I'm going to keep that one on my list so that I can go back and listen to it later. So yeah, just kind of why I brought that one up. But yeah.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
yeah, absolutely. And I feel like, so now that you say that, I think the episode that kind of is the same for me, has to relate to the Kawa model and teachers. I think, you know, there's us and teachers, we it could be a love hate relationship, just trying to get supports in and trying to understand their schedules, or just scheduling in general. And that episode really just kind of brings me back to the teachers are truly our biggest fans when it comes to what we're able to do for their student, because their whole goal is to get that student to learn and participate and be functional within their space as well. So the Kawa model, and how it relates to OT, I think, is definitely one I listened to, and I'm like, Yeah, we got to give our teachers a little bit more. Grace. We got to give a little bit more grace, maybe during that IEP meeting to just to make sure we're all on the same page and we're all understanding everyone's perspective. So I absolutely agree with you.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, yeah. And kind of tagging along that's a perfect segue for this advocacy on the podcast, we've often discussed advocating for yourself and you're in a, I wouldn't say unique. You know, there's other OTs, other ot practitioners in a similar situation to you, where you're contracted, you've got some time in the schools, time outside the schools, but we've often talked about advocating, and, you know, understanding your role, helping others to understand the OT role, or even expand our scope in the school setting. And have you been able to take that and kind of apply it to your practice at all?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yes. So funny enough. You know, the biggest question is, what is ot what is it? I don't understand what you do. You do it. I thought that was for, you know, people who had strokes, and how are you going to help my child? Is it just handwriting? I think that's a train of thought a lot of us get a lot of the time. And I think the podcast has made me more confident and knowledgeable about just what we do, as well as if we are not currently in a space, there's ways that we can advocate for ourselves to be in that space. And so specifically with my schools, there's there's been times where it hasn't been understood why ot should be involved in maybe specials or extracurricular activities at the schools. And so I've been able to hold meetings and advocate why behaviorally sensory and provide these, these tools and strategies to teachers who have teachers and, you know, volunteers at the schools who have no concept of what that means, but they see the children struggle. So I that's a really unique opportunity that I've, I've had within my schools, as well as, you know, creating a different, what's the right word, maybe a different perspective on the children that receive support services, being able to collaborate with teachers and bring them into what the child needs and how their space is impacting not only the teacher but the child. Because we all know co regulation, if the teachers are dysregulated, so is the child. So I've, I've made some really great connections at my schools, and I think because of that connection and my willingness to educate and advocate for OT. But also, my child has kind of created a different realm of OT on these campuses. So I, you know, you can always advocate for yourself. And, you know, making the connections is a really a big part of that as well.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, yeah, you've mentioned some of the resources that like, because we do with the show notes if, if a speaker makes something available to us, whether it be a handout, whether it be a list of resources that they have, whatever it might be, we'll often put it on the show notes at otschoolhouse com, slash episode, and then the number, who knows there might be something there with this episode with Taylor, I'm trying to get her to convince a Spotify playlist for us. We'll see if it happens. But you mentioned those earlier, and have you ever actually used those to help you to describe what OT is, or use those as a resource to help you to help a teacher understand how you can better support a student?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yes, absolutely. So I know there's some specific episodes that have their own understanding of OT that, you know, provide little handouts, or there's like tidbits in the podcast episodes that give kind of their elevator speech. So I've definitely come to refine my own and having that kind of like in my back pocket anytime someone's ready to ask me. But when it comes to resources to, you know, we there was episode on zones of regulation, and so they have, you know, 1,000,001 free resources on their website. And so I was able to take that and apply it with my kids. But what led me from that was I had some kids that were having a really hard time understanding the concept of being a color that abstract thought was just it was really missing with them. So having that basis knowledge of these resources, I'd be able to create my own. So I kind of have a blended behavior, silly scale, that still uses colors as an option, but with words and bringing the child into that to identify their behaviors and appropriate spaces as well as, you know, all of their handwriting episodes. There's so many different ones about using, you know, writing on black paper with chalk, and how that provides a completely different contrast for the brain, and how to apply it. And so I've done that with creating my own handwriting checklist with grocer movements to, you know, evolve the type of learning, a multi sensory learning approach. So there's so many opportunities to identify the resources, but as well as taking them and individualizing them for either your caseload or specific children who would benefit from it, but they need some tweaks for themselves.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, wow, that's really cool. Again. Just kind of, for me, it's like an out of body experience, hearing people talk about the podcast in this way. But yeah, so collaboration, this is always a topic that that's difficult. I think all of us want to collaborate more, but it is very difficult because collaboration is a two way street, right? Like we can't just make a decision to collaborate, we have to have other people who also want to collaborate with us, whether it be teachers, administrators, parents. I know you also work with parents, because you're not just in the schools, but yeah, what are, what are a few tips that you've heard over the episodes to help you kind of with this collaboration process.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
So one thing when it comes to collaboration is that you have to meet the other person on their level, if they are another provider, what do they know about ot have they ever collaborated with occupational therapists before? Do you guys have the same goals based off what your you know what your child and your case looks like with parents? Are parents 100% on board with the diagnosis that their child was given, or with the supports that they need? Do they understand what their child is experiencing, getting on their level first, and establishing a baseline and building that rapport with them, just like we do we're kids, I would say, is step one. If you don't have that any type of information or adjustment or need that you throw on them is not going to be reciprocated in the way that we may think it is. Yeah, so once, once you've kind of established that, you know, sort of baseline, I think, trying to have a meeting with them of some sorts, or just through email, I know that's so hard with everyone's schedules, and you know, everyone's caseload is different, but, you know, really identifying what that looks like for each other and then testing it out. Maybe you do, you know, a co treating type session together and it doesn't go right. Awesome. Regroup. Trial error is the same way as it comes with collaboration. I know I'm really lucky, and my the owner of my company, Alyssa, she's a speech language pathologist. So her and I actually get to co treat fairly often on our sessions with our kids, who we share. And I think the first one, in my perspective, it was crash and burn, because that was the first time as a true practicing ot what I needed to do, trying to help her goals, trying to maintain mine. And I think the more that we've done it, and the more that we felt comfortable identifying our common ground, the better our sessions have been, and the better the progress has been for our kids.
Jayson Davies
Yeah, absolutely. I love it. I love it. I kind of want to back away from the podcast just a little bit, because you do. You're a new school based OT, but you're not a new school based OT. You've got a year and a half, you've done a lot of research, you've learned a lot in the last 18 months or so. And so I do just want to give you an opportunity, especially right now. This episode is coming out in September. I believe there's a lot of people starting their first month, their first two months, in the school based system. And so what are just a few tips you have in general for brand new school based ot practitioners?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Absolutely so first off, welcome, welcome to the craziness that is otschool based, you know, but my top three, first one, seek out mentorship, whether that is past employees. That is past co workers, current co workers. You know, external ways like this, podcast, Facebook, groups, Instagram, anything. Find something that you can bounce ideas off of or absorb, because imposter syndrome runs rampant in our field. And you know, we'd say, maybe all of healthcare, I know for myself, that was one thing I needed. Because there's days where I'm like, Oh my gosh, did I ever learn this? Am I even? Do I even, am I even certified? Knowing that's not the case, obviously I am, and I'm practicing. It's you need to feel grounded in that, because your education is valuable, your experience is valuable, and the way that you're being a therapist is valuable. So seek out mentorship any way that you can. You know another tip is trial and error. I know I've mentioned it several times throughout this episode, but I can't emphasize it enough, especially being so new, we see all these opportunities. We see all these resources and tools. And if we apply it once and it didn't go great, don't count it out. Try it again with a different student. Approach it in a different way. We are so brilliant when it comes to activity analysis, use that and trial and error through all of those processes, whether it's games, ideas, assessments, screenings, you name it, trial and error, will be your best friend, because that's the only way that you you can truly learn my last one. Get back into play. Don't get caught up in all of the the task to do, lists, whether that's the documentation, the writing, the meetings when you're with your child, you. Play in the school setting, children can still learn through play in any way that may look like to them. You can always incorporate academic components, or maybe that's handwriting, or whatever it is that you're trying to accomplish with them. Children learn best through multi sensory and play, and so don't forget that at the root, that's what you're able to do?
Jayson Davies
Yeah, Yeah. I love those. All great ones and, and that second one that you mentioned where, you know, don't be afraid to make mistakes, like we're going to make mistakes. You can't not make mistakes. You are human. But as you were talking about that one, something popped into my head, kind of taking this back to the podcast again. But have there been any episodes where you almost have, like, shiny object syndrome from for it where, like, maybe the maybe the episode was just awesome. It was, like, some great stuff, but right now wasn't the right time for you to go down that path, or right now maybe it didn't apply to your situation, even though you loved every second of it, and the guest was amazing. Have you experienced that? And if so, kind of, how did you deal with it? Potentially?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah, absolutely. So there, there's been a few, there's, you know, there's episodes talking about dysgraphia and supports, and that one specifically, I currently don't have any children with dysgraphia or diagnosed dysgraphia on my caseload, but to me, I'm like, Oh, this is so amazing. What if all of my kids have it and they're just not diagnosed, and that's not my that's not within my scope. But I'm like, This is so amazing. And I think that's just kind of a nugget that I have in my back pocket for a time where I'm going to be working on a handwriting activity, or we're reading something, and I'm going to be like, Huh? Let me pull out some of these supports that I once learned and let me apply it then. So that's definitely a back pocket episode.
Jayson Davies
Awesome, awesome. All right, I've got a last few questions here, and we're gonna have a little bit of fun, especially with this next one. You've listened to a lot of episodes you mentioned. What is one episode we haven't had that you wish we did have?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Interesting I would love if there was an episode about, you know, someone from the ABA realm and an OT who are actively collaborating together within The schools. I think that would be such a beneficial episode for both parties to understand how we can work together and how we can transition our minds and our strategies and our language to be very neurodivergent affirming. I think that's something that would be a very, very impactful episode.
Jayson Davies
I love that you chose, like, the hardest potential episode to choose. Like, I can't make that happen overnight, no. But we did have an ABA therapist on a long time ago. Gosh, I'm blanking on his name even. But you threw in the extra component of how an ABA therapist and an OT or an OT practitioner are collaborating, that is a good one. And I know there are some that are doing it. I have a few people that are even coming to mind, but yeah, I think that'd be a great episode. And not just for the How to practical part of it, but as you kind of alluded to. I think it would be great for both professions in general, like, there is a lot of, I'll just be very frank here. There's a lot of animosity between the two. Everyone knows it. No one's saying there isn't, unless you're in front of the other professional. But, yeah, I think that would be a great topic. Thanks for sharing that. We'll have to. We'll have to work on that. And then I want to go back. I wrote down, as you were talking earlier, you mentioned the primitive reflex episode and then how it's leading to taking additional coursework on that. And as you were talking, I kind of jotted this down. I wanted to know kind of how you went from listening to the episode to then researching and choosing a program, because there, I mean, we can talk about anything on the podcast, but there's 18 different programs out there for just about every single thing under the sun, right? So, I mean, sensory is a great example of that. There's like, three or four different primary sensory courses that that people know of. But how did you go about deciding which one you wanted to take and go about taking that one.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah. So I when I was researching, you know, different courses or continuing education opportunities, specifically for prone to reflexes, I mean, there was 1,000,001 options, yeah, to kind of see a theme with them, that they were either all like only OTs, only, you know physical therapy, or, you know, a hard sensory behavior lens on it, which is a, obviously a component. But when it came to choosing my specific course, it incorporates OTS. Neurology, sensory behavior and trauma, informed care. And to me, you know, once researching it, that's really what it encompasses. It, it's a really holistic view of primitive reflexes. So I wanted a very broad view, and not just from one specific lens, because I think we there's a lot to learn from, you know, neurology and psychology and physical therapy, and we have the ability to kind of encompass all of that. So that's what I thought would be the best actually, Dr I believe she goes by Lyons now, but verlicia Gibbs lions, yep, yes, she was at our back to school conference, and she's actually the OT that that does that, course, along with Karen Pryor, the physical therapist. So it's a wonderful course, if anyone's interested.
Jayson Davies
Is that the is that the pessi one, or is it a different pessi? Okay, well, we'll be sure to link to it in the show notes, so that we can get anyone interested access to that. Very cool. All right, as we start to wrap this up here, I'm curious, and maybe others are curious as well. But you have been a school based ot practitioner for 18 months now. You've done a lot already. I mean, you're using the podcast to do things. You're taking a primitive reflex. Course, it seems like you're kind of moving forward. What are some goals that you have in your ot career? Just kind of things that you're interested Do you want to one day own a business? Do you want to stay in the schools forever? What? What are you thinking?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah. So I, even before grad school, I worked as a sensory motor aid for an outpatient pediatric clinic, and the woman that owned her practice, I was enamored with. I loved everything about the way she ran the business. When she was kind of teaching me the back end, and I was like, I am going to own my own business one day, and it's going to be amazing. And now that I'm I'm in the school system, and I have this beautiful mix of, you know, school, home and community, I feel like I just want to progress the company that I'm with and find something specific in the schools that I can almost create a alternative look to treatment from what I mean by that is kind of, it doesn't have to be in a room. Let's get us out on the campus. What can we do for the campus? How can we help admin? How can we kind of elaborate that so kind of expanding more. So what school based ot looks like is really my long term goal.
Jayson Davies
I love it. I love that. And, and I'm sure you've already listened to the episode, but get in contact with Sue basic. Sue basic is she's got programs, but I think that a lot of people who are implementing her programs are putting their own spin on it. And I think that's really cool, you know, it's things are designed to evolve, right? Well, what was great yesterday may not be great tomorrow, or it may still be great, but in a slightly different way. And I think that that is something that I've said a lot, is just, you know, don't, don't do something, especially when you get a brand new job at a school, don't continue doing something that has always been done at the school for the sole purpose that that's the way they did it, right? Like if you walk in and the caseload is 30 kids one time a week, 30 minutes pull out. That doesn't mean that you have to have 30 kids one time a week, 30 minutes pull out. Next year, you could have 15 kids, push in, 15 kids, pull out. You can do whatever you want so far or so, be it, as long as you are doing best by the children. So I love your idea of kind of doing things a little bit differently, right, to support others. So very cool. All right. To wrap this up, is there anything else you know you shared a lot of very helpful tips today, but is there anything else you'd like to share with our listeners, just in general about school based occupational therapy.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yeah, school based OT is, is fabulous. I feel like we get, I mean, we're in the nitty gritty with our kids when their main occupation at this stage of life is their education and playing, and we have the beautiful opportunity to blend both of them as well as engage with the people that spend 99% of the time with them, their teachers, their extracurricular activity, teachers and their parents. And you've entered a beautiful space, and you have this beautiful resource at the podcast. If you're listening even only to this one, go check out all the other ones and all the beautiful resources and feel confident in what you're doing. You have earned it. You've earned your degree, you've earned the job that you're in, and you've earned the space to advocate for yourself and for your kids. So don't let the tough days dictate you know the career ahead of you.
Jayson Davies
I love it. I love it. And we like to say, a lot of us as ot practitioners, the like play is my favorite occupation, and we work on a lot of play in school based OT, but a lot of times when we do that, I feel like it's very one on one play based. And I think in a lot of ways that you're talking about it today is, you know, getting away from just the one on one play and just really facilitating play. At a larger level, and making sure that all kids have access to play, and that teachers understand the importance of play on their academic achievement over time. And I think that's just fantastic. So Taylor, thank you so much. We really appreciate it. And before I let you go, what is the best way for anyone to learn more about yourself?
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yes, so I have a Instagram account that's ot related. My username is Dr Taylor, underscore, OT. I It's newer, but I will be loading it up with information. Day in the Life, says an OT, all of that fun stuff. And I'd love to connect with you guys on there as well as a I have a teacher pay teacher account. So the username for that, and I believe all this stuff will be in the show notes as well, if you're not near, something to write down, but it's a CT therapies. I have my resources that I've created by listening from the podcast, as well as a intervention activity for you guys on there as well.
Jayson Davies
Awesome. Well, you can find her on Instagram. You can find her on TPT, and we will definitely link to that. Taylor, thank you so much for two things. One, reaching out and kind of just bringing this eye opening idea to the podcast, you know, just coming on here to talk about how to use the podcast to learn. I think that is just a great idea. I'm glad we did this, and I I'm glad that you were the one to to bring it up and to be on this episode. So we really appreciate you being here today.
Dr. Taylor Poirier OTR/L
Yes. Thank you so much for creating the space, having this podcast and these platforms, and for for having me on. I had a great time, and I hope everyone else gains at least something from it. I know talking and Chitty chat with you, it definitely has the ball rolling in my in my head for ideas. So thank you so much.
Jayson Davies
Awesome. Thank you, one more time, a big thank you to Taylor for sharing her knowledge with all of us. It is exciting to hear how she is using the podcast episodes to her advantage and implementing so many great practices within her role as a school based occupational therapist. If you're interested in checking out Taylor's playlist that I teased about a little bit during that episode. You can check it out within the show notes, we actually put together an entire Taylor's playlist of otschoolhouse com podcast episodes, and you can find that over at the show notes, at otschoolhouse com slash Episode 159, also on the show notes, you can learn more about Taylor and how she is supporting school based ot practitioners through resources on teachers, pay teachers. One other thing, if you're looking for a group of school based occupational therapy practitioners to learn, collaborate and share resources with, be sure to check out the otschoolhouse com collaborative. The otschoolhouse com collaborative is the go to online community where school based ot practitioners learn together with aota approved CEU courses, support one another through live and Asynchronous means, and share goals, research and other helpful resources. Not to forget, members of the collaborative can also earn professional development hours for listening to the otschoolhouse Comcast, plus it's the only place where I consistently go online and regularly answer ot practitioners questions. So if you'd like my support and the support of 200 other school based ot practitioners, be sure to check out the otschoolhouse com collaborative at otschoolhouse com slash collab. I hope to see you there. Thanks again for tuning in, and we'll see you next time on the otschoolhouse com podcast.
Amazing Narrator
Thank you for listening to the otschoolhouse podcast for more ways to help you and your students succeed right now, head on over to otschoolhouse com Until next time class is dismissed.
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